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Storm over bursary for white men
http://www.suntimes.co.za/2004/05/16/news/news07.asp
The government and university challenge a will made in 1920
Jeanne Van Der Merwe
In 1920, Scarbrow ordered that his estate be placed in trust and used
to fund scholarships for male matriculants, 'of European descent,
gentile and with limited or no means'
....
The state is launching a legal challenge to a 1920 trust fund that
pays out university scholarships only to white men.
If it succeeds, it could open the way for challenges to other estates
whose restrictions could prove unconstitutional.
The Scarbrow Bursary Fund Testamentary Trust has awarded scholarships
for overseas studies to white, male graduates of the University of
Cape Town since the 1920s.
Now, the national Education Department and the University of Cape Town
(UCT) are seeking an order to change the conditions of the will which
set up the trust. It will be the first time the Constitution is used,
along with more conventional legal routes, to change a will.
In 1920, Edmund Scarbrow ordered that his estate be placed in trust
and used to fund scholarships for male matriculants "of European
descent, gentile and with limited or no means".
In a codicil he added a few months later, he said neither "persons of
Jewish descent" nor "females of all nationalities" would be eligible
for the scholarships.
Scarbrow died in 1921 and the fund has paid out the scholarships
since.
The trust's manager, Lorna Prosser, refused this week to divulge how
much the estate was worth or how often it paid out bursaries.
Former Education Minister Kader Asmal started the legal proceedings
against the trust after it called for applicants in a Cape Town
newspaper in 2002.
He wrote to Syfrets, the trust's administrators, asking that the
provision limiting the scholarships to white males be altered. Syfrets
responded by saying its attorneys had investigated "the legality of
discriminatory clauses in wills under the new Constitution" and found
that the Constitution also protected citizens' freedom to make wills.
Asmal filed the application in the Cape High Court last month.
The registrar of UCT, Hugh Amoore, said: "It is an important test case
because we believe that other bursaries or awards with conditions
which are repugnant to the Constitution could be dealt with in a
similar way if this application succeeds."
This is not the first time Scarbrow's wishes have been found
inappropriate. In 1969, UCT refused to administer the bursaries
because of the "discriminating conditions attaching to [the] awards".
The Master of the High Court said in court papers: "Should the court
grant the application this could have repercussions for various other
existing trusts which are not parties to these proceedings. To date no
case involving charitable or other trust objects has been decided
under the new Constitution or its related legislation."
Professor Johan van Schalkwyk of the University of the Free State's
law faculty said a similar application, against another charitable
trust had succeeded before the new Constitution was adopted.
Peter Jordi, an attorney with Wits University's Law Clinic, said if
the application was successful, it could lead to similar cases being
made against other trusts with restrictive conditions.
"You could use this case to say that either trust deeds for other
similar bursary funds should be changed or that they must be changed
by taking them to court."
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"G. Bartels" <bartelq77@yahoo.com> wrote in message
Storm over bursary for white men
http://www.suntimes.co.za/2004/05/16/news/news07.asp
The government and university challenge a will made in 1920
Jeanne Van Der Merwe
If it succeeds, it could open the way for challenges to other
estates
whose restrictions could prove unconstitutional.
<Snip>
In a codicil he added a few months later, he said neither "persons
of
Jewish descent" nor "females of all nationalities" would be
eligible
for the scholarships.
<Snip>
The registrar of UCT, Hugh Amoore, said: "It is an important test
case
because we believe that other bursaries or awards with conditions
which are repugnant to the Constitution could be dealt with in a
similar way if this application succeeds."
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
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"G. Bartels" <bartelq77@yahoo.com> wrote in message
estates
<Snip>
of
eligible
<Snip>
case
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
Post-grad work??? In what? Lesbian studies, homosexual Christianity of
witchcraft?
F
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Moira de Swardt wrote:
"G. Bartels" <bartelq77@yahoo.com> wrote in message
estates
<Snip>
of
eligible
<Snip>
case
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
Die vraag is of die regering die reg het (en indien wel, of dit 'n goeie
ding is) om in 'n persoon se persoonlike voorkeur in te meng. Onthou vir
elke besluit wat die regering van jou wegneem is dit een minder wat jy
die vryheid voor het om te mag maak. Ek het nie 'n pyn daarmee as iemand
'n rassis is nie. Almal diskrimineer op een of ander manier teen iets of
iemand. Dit is seker maar die ou omie se goeie reg om te s vir wie hy
geld wil nalaat of nie. Ek dink dit het niks met enige iemand te make
waarom hy dit doen nie. Dit is sy keuse. Ek het pyne met wat mense doen
en nie wat hulle dink nie. As jy iemand doodmaak omdat jy 'n rassis is
dan is dit verkeerd! Maar die ou man (in my opinie) het die reg om sy
geld te spandeer op wie en wat hy wil. Iemand se reg om hulle hande op
daardie reeds verdiende geld te kry is minder as die ou wat dit verdien
het se reg om te bepaal hoe hy dit spandeer selfs na sy dood. Ek is
seker daar is testamente wat die teenoorgestelde m.a.w net swart mense
bevoordeel.
Groete
Plato
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"Plato" <plato@thenewacademy.com> wrote in message
Moira de Swardt wrote:
Die vraag is of die regering die reg het (en indien wel, of dit 'n
goeie
ding is) om in 'n persoon se persoonlike voorkeur in te meng.
Onthou vir
elke besluit wat die regering van jou wegneem is dit een minder
wat jy
die vryheid voor het om te mag maak. Ek het nie 'n pyn daarmee as
iemand
'n rassis is nie. Almal diskrimineer op een of ander manier teen
iets of
iemand. Dit is seker maar die ou omie se goeie reg om te s vir
wie hy
geld wil nalaat of nie. Ek dink dit het niks met enige iemand te
make
waarom hy dit doen nie. Dit is sy keuse. Ek het pyne met wat mense
doen
en nie wat hulle dink nie. As jy iemand doodmaak omdat jy 'n
rassis is
dan is dit verkeerd! Maar die ou man (in my opinie) het die reg om
sy
geld te spandeer op wie en wat hy wil. Iemand se reg om hulle
hande op
daardie reeds verdiende geld te kry is minder as die ou wat dit
verdien
het se reg om te bepaal hoe hy dit spandeer selfs na sy dood. Ek
is
seker daar is testamente wat die teenoorgestelde m.a.w net swart
mense
bevoordeel.
There is that point, of course, and the right to discriminate is an
interesting concept. But look at it from the angle of
legislatively doing away with discrimination. That opens all sorts
of cans of worms that the present government wants left intact. If
one cannot discriminate with bursaries one cannot discriminate with
jobs. Etc.
The reality of discrimination will always be there. And it is
probably true that white males will continue to get preferential
treatment whenever legislation doesn't prevent it.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
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"Frank" <buri@knology.net> wrote in message
Post-grad work??? In what? Lesbian studies, homosexual
Christianity of
witchcraft?
Ethics. Would you like me to explain what that is?
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
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Hash: SHA1
"Plato" <plato@thenewacademy.com> wrote in message
goeie
Onthou vir
wat jy
iemand
iets of
wie hy
make
doen
rassis is
sy
hande op
verdien
is
mense
There is that point, of course, and the right to discriminate is an
interesting concept. But look at it from the angle of
legislatively doing away with discrimination. That opens all sorts
of cans of worms that the present government wants left intact. If
one cannot discriminate with bursaries one cannot discriminate with
jobs. Etc.
The reality of discrimination will always be there. And it is
probably true that white males will continue to get preferential
treatment whenever legislation doesn't prevent it.
That's a crock of shyte Moira!!!
White makes are getting shafted on a daily basis with NO PROTECTION
from the law.
Legislation actively provides the legal right for discrimination
AGAINST WHITE MALES IN SOUTH AFRICA>
But, more to the point, the bursary was the choice of an individual.
The government has NO RIGHT to determine how the benefactor may spend
his money or demand that his money be spent.
What this controversy has now done is ensure that future grants will
be written to allow for this, in the event of governmunt interference
then NO GRANT will be available and the money will be spent feeding
animals at the zoo or something equally eccentric.
If I leave my money for my son and his son and his son's son to use,
then the govermunt has NO SAY and so it should be in this instance as
well.
Bodie.. (tired of everybody being so @$#*ing politically correct that
the let themselves get @$#*ed in the butt just to be "accepted."
Fuck the lot of them!!!
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iQA/AwUBQUiX4/8pT4niCwSBEQLwUACdG5tkFfHCOjCv4vzBJErXDfo4amcAn2kT
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Bodie.. (tired of everybody being so @$#*ing politically correct that
the let themselves get @$#*ed in the butt just to be "accepted."
Fuck the lot of them!!!
I like your views. Can I subscribe to your newsletter?
Spizz
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"Bodie" <Bodie@home.net> wrote in message
"Moira de Swardt" <moira.deswardt@wol.co.za> wrote in message
The reality of discrimination will always be there. And it is
probably true that white males will continue to get preferential
treatment whenever legislation doesn't prevent it.
That's a crock of shyte Moira!!!
White makes are getting shafted on a daily basis with NO
PROTECTION
from the law.
Legislation actively provides the legal right for discrimination
AGAINST WHITE MALES IN SOUTH AFRICA
That's what I said. Instead of the massive preferential treatment
white males have always enjoyed there is now legislation preventing
it.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
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Read: "Hold back this day" by Ward Kendall and you`ll understand where are
we going
--
Truth needs no laws to support it. Throughout history, only liars and lies
resort to the courts to mandate belief
Storm over bursary for white men
http://www.suntimes.co.za/2004/05/16/news/news07.asp
The government and university challenge a will made in 1920
Jeanne Van Der Merwe
In 1920, Scarbrow ordered that his estate be placed in trust and used
to fund scholarships for male matriculants, 'of European descent,
gentile and with limited or no means'
...
The state is launching a legal challenge to a 1920 trust fund that
pays out university scholarships only to white men.
If it succeeds, it could open the way for challenges to other estates
whose restrictions could prove unconstitutional.
The Scarbrow Bursary Fund Testamentary Trust has awarded scholarships
for overseas studies to white, male graduates of the University of
Cape Town since the 1920s.
Now, the national Education Department and the University of Cape Town
(UCT) are seeking an order to change the conditions of the will which
set up the trust. It will be the first time the Constitution is used,
along with more conventional legal routes, to change a will.
In 1920, Edmund Scarbrow ordered that his estate be placed in trust
and used to fund scholarships for male matriculants "of European
descent, gentile and with limited or no means".
In a codicil he added a few months later, he said neither "persons of
Jewish descent" nor "females of all nationalities" would be eligible
for the scholarships.
Scarbrow died in 1921 and the fund has paid out the scholarships
since.
The trust's manager, Lorna Prosser, refused this week to divulge how
much the estate was worth or how often it paid out bursaries.
Former Education Minister Kader Asmal started the legal proceedings
against the trust after it called for applicants in a Cape Town
newspaper in 2002.
He wrote to Syfrets, the trust's administrators, asking that the
provision limiting the scholarships to white males be altered. Syfrets
responded by saying its attorneys had investigated "the legality of
discriminatory clauses in wills under the new Constitution" and found
that the Constitution also protected citizens' freedom to make wills.
Asmal filed the application in the Cape High Court last month.
The registrar of UCT, Hugh Amoore, said: "It is an important test case
because we believe that other bursaries or awards with conditions
which are repugnant to the Constitution could be dealt with in a
similar way if this application succeeds."
This is not the first time Scarbrow's wishes have been found
inappropriate. In 1969, UCT refused to administer the bursaries
because of the "discriminating conditions attaching to [the] awards".
The Master of the High Court said in court papers: "Should the court
grant the application this could have repercussions for various other
existing trusts which are not parties to these proceedings. To date no
case involving charitable or other trust objects has been decided
under the new Constitution or its related legislation."
Professor Johan van Schalkwyk of the University of the Free State's
law faculty said a similar application, against another charitable
trust had succeeded before the new Constitution was adopted.
Peter Jordi, an attorney with Wits University's Law Clinic, said if
the application was successful, it could lead to similar cases being
made against other trusts with restrictive conditions.
"You could use this case to say that either trust deeds for other
similar bursary funds should be changed or that they must be changed
by taking them to court."
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case
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
A bursary is a gift. It is up to the donor to decide who to give it to. If
the donor wishes to give it to minorities - chosen by whatever caprice he
might wish to indulge in - then it is his choice.
I see no reason why a bursary shouldn't be given to people with red-hair,
left-handers, monocular people, rugby players or to dwarfs if the donor so
wishes. I can see that, in the latter case, there might be a question of
whether a pygmy should properly be considered a dwarf for the purposes of a
posthumous bursary, but not that it should be thrown open to giants.
If people are not free to give bursaries as they wish then they are likely
not to give bursaries - and that is a bad thing.
--
Sylvia: "You must think me a stupid American #@&@
."
Neighbour: "Not at all, I assumed that you were Canadian" - dialogue from
the film 'Sylvia'
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Bodie.. (tired of everybody being so @$#*ing politically correct that
the let themselves get @$#*ed in the butt just to be "accepted."
Fuck the lot of them!!!
I think you'll find that my response to this idea was not politically
correct - so it is not everybody.
I agree that the donor of a busary has a right to decide the conditions of
his gift.
My brother had a bursary which came with the peculiar condition that he had
to keep a framed photograph of the donor and his family in a prominent place
in his study - it didn't do anything for the decor and they weren't a very
photogenic lot, but he, quite properly, honoured the condition.
--
Sylvia: "You must think me a stupid American #@&@
."
Neighbour: "Not at all, I assumed that you were Canadian" - dialogue from
the film 'Sylvia'
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Agreed.
Bodie wrote:
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Hash: SHA1
That's a crock of shyte Moira!!!
White makes are getting shafted on a daily basis with NO PROTECTION
from the law.
Legislation actively provides the legal right for discrimination
AGAINST WHITE MALES IN SOUTH AFRICA>
But, more to the point, the bursary was the choice of an individual.
The government has NO RIGHT to determine how the benefactor may spend
his money or demand that his money be spent.
What this controversy has now done is ensure that future grants will
be written to allow for this, in the event of governmunt interference
then NO GRANT will be available and the money will be spent feeding
animals at the zoo or something equally eccentric.
If I leave my money for my son and his son and his son's son to use,
then the govermunt has NO SAY and so it should be in this instance as
well.
Bodie.. (tired of everybody being so @$#*ing politically correct that
the let themselves get @$#*ed in the butt just to be "accepted."
Fuck the lot of them!!!
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Version: PGP 8.0.2
Comment: Why comment on PGPerfection?
iQA/AwUBQUiX4/8pT4niCwSBEQLwUACdG5tkFfHCOjCv4vzBJErXDfo4amcAn2kT
dragGuoAbLB/mQTdg1XTt521
=x4XN
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"G. Bartels" <bartelq77@yahoo.com> wrote in message
estates
<Snip>
of
eligible
<Snip>
case
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
Then do you support the elimination of affirmtive action ie racial set aside
quotas as well?
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Storm over bursary for white men
http://www.suntimes.co.za/2004/05/16/news/news07.asp
Professor Johan van Schalkwyk of the University of the Free State's
law faculty said a similar application, against another charitable
trust had succeeded before the new Constitution was adopted.
Peter Jordi, an attorney with Wits University's Law Clinic, said if
the application was successful, it could lead to similar cases being
made against other trusts with restrictive conditions.
"You could use this case to say that either trust deeds for other
similar bursary funds should be changed or that they must be changed
by taking them to court."
What about Cecil Rhodes's will and the restrictions on the beneficiaries of
a Rhodes scholaship, ie. Commonwealth citizen, US citizens and
Germans ?
retired/uk.
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I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
I hope it does not succeed, after all it was HIS money, not tax-payers
money.
If I had loads of money to leave (not the case!) I'd like to be able to
decide
whom I'd like to leave it to, NOT for politicians to decide.
Next, (give it a year or two) your lot will decide to exclude white males in
favour of
Black Lesbians exclusively. Why not, once you can change the Rules
anything is possible.
retired/uk.
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"The Enlightenment" <bernxard@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
"Moira de Swardt" <moira.deswardt@wol.co.za> wrote in message
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
Then do you support the elimination of affirmtive action ie racial set
aside
quotas as well?
Absolutely.
The best student for the best bursary regardless of colour or sex. That
means that if the best student is a white male he should be given the
bursary regardless of the fact that five black females are also applying for
it and that they won't be able to study without it. And vice versa.
The best candidate for the job regardless of colour or sex. That means that
if the best candidate is a white male he should get the job regardless of
whether a black lesbian just happens to be the other candidate. And vice
versa.
No racial, gender, sexual orientation quotas.
Having said that, it makes sense that people will be employed within
corporate cultures. I do sometimes think that the "best candidate" is not
necessarily the one with the best papers, but the one who will make the best
fit. A raunchy straight man with wonderful qualifications or a very butch
lesbian with overseas experience in beauty work may want to be a beautician
at a place where there are lots of naked women, but an ugly, but suitably
trained, effiminate gay man may make a better fit because he won't threaten
the naked female clients, whereas an attractive straight female with merely
adequate qualifications may make the best fit because that's what naked
female clients expect at beauty salons and spas.
I also think that it is within my rights to employ only gay men if I so
choose if I own a business. Or straight women. Of any colour. And that
the liklihood that they will reflect the same demographics as my dinner
party guests would be high.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
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Moira de Swardt wrote:
"The Enlightenment" <bernxard@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
I think this is fabulous. I hope it succeeds. Why should black
females, black males, white females, white males etc. get bursaries
based on colour and sex? Give the bursaries to the students that
have worked the hardest for them. I couldn't get a bursary this
year for post-grad work.
aside
Absolutely.
The best student for the best bursary regardless of colour or sex. That
means that if the best student is a white male he should be given the
bursary regardless of the fact that five black females are also applying for
it and that they won't be able to study without it. And vice versa.
The best candidate for the job regardless of colour or sex. That means that
if the best candidate is a white male he should get the job regardless of
whether a black lesbian just happens to be the other candidate. And vice
versa.
No racial, gender, sexual orientation quotas.
Having said that, it makes sense that people will be employed within
corporate cultures. I do sometimes think that the "best candidate" is not
necessarily the one with the best papers, but the one who will make the best
fit. A raunchy straight man with wonderful qualifications or a very butch
lesbian with overseas experience in beauty work may want to be a beautician
at a place where there are lots of naked women, but an ugly, but suitably
trained, effiminate gay man may make a better fit because he won't threaten
the naked female clients, whereas an attractive straight female with merely
adequate qualifications may make the best fit because that's what naked
female clients expect at beauty salons and spas.
I also think that it is within my rights to employ only gay men if I so
choose if I own a business. Or straight women. Of any colour. And that
the liklihood that they will reflect the same demographics as my dinner
party guests would be high.
Moira, the Faerie Godmother
Wow. Great writ...
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