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My son is mentally disabled and has lived in the same apartment complex
for 28 years. In March of 2007 a landscape contractor employed by the
complex decided to start their job of cleaning the winter sand/salt from
the parking lots by covering my son and his car with sand. The complex
has 150 apartments and 600 parking spaces. These (8) guys including
and under the direction of the owner entered the area of buidings my son
lives in and saw him with his car hood up and in a bad position. Rather
than go to any border of this area and start there, they crossed 3
parking lots and 60 parking spaces to approach my son. The owner asked
my son if he could move his car even though he could see the battery was
removed (for charging). Oh, before I forget the apartment management
had not warned residents they would be doing this work and never have
till this year (March 2008) they gave all residents notice for the first
time in 28 years. Anyway when my son said he could'nt move his car the
owner ordered his crew to start their machines and they covered my son
and every exposed part of his car with sand. This took only a couple of
minutes and when they were done the owner told his crew to shut off
their machines. At that time my son said to him " why did you do this,
and is this the way you always treat poor people " the owner answered "
I am poor too but at least I work ". Then the owner and his crew
walked away and went to the border of the property and started his job
there. They never stopped again till they finished the whole 3 parking
lots
an hour later. My son was too scared to even call the police or report
what happened to the management till days later. When he reported to
the manager she said she believed my son and she would take care of it,
she also admitted to having a problem with a bigoted former head of
maintenance that hired the landscape company concerned. A week later
these guys from the landscape company were back at my sons 1st floor
window talking about commiting a hate crime towards him (my son). That
day my son went to report this to the manager again, and again she said
she would deal with it. She sent her head of maintenance to see the
landscape company owner and he denied that anything had happened. Oh,
this landscape company does the painting for the apartment complex also.
When the head of maintenace returned he told my son the only thing they
could do was warn my son whenever the landscapers would be on property.
So for the next six months my son left the property with his car every
tuesday. Yet the landscaper would come on any other day of the week
while my son was never warned. Everytime my son complained to management
about this they got more angry with him, telling my son it was becoming
a pain to need to warn him when they actually weren't even keeping their
own agreement to do so. Then at the end of August last year the
landscape company showed up on a friday without warning and came very
close to my son while he was outside with one of his neighbors. At that
point my son had not gone into the office for over a month but decided
to tell the manager about this latest event. When he went in the
manager took him into her office and immediately said " we have gone
above and beyond the call of duty for you ".
My son could not believe how insensitive she was being and asked her if
she would write what she said down. With that she started screaming at
my son to get out and as she opened her door to the open communitty room
with other residents present kept yelling get out, get out and she also
said she was gonna call her lawyer and the she corrected herself and
said our lawyer. My son left the building shaking. A week later he
received his first letter about what had happened last March but now
everthing was reversed actually blaming the victim for what had happened
because " he was working on his car ". The letter also told my son
they would no longer be tellng him when the landscapers were coming, and
that if my son did'nt know what day tuesday was he could remind himself
by marking it on the calender that the office sends out on their monthly
newsletter. This was belittling my son and anyway he had left the
property every tuesday whether he had been warned or not. The problem
was when they would show up on every other day other than tuesday and
their was no warning. Of course she does not mention this in her
letter. Also she refers to what happened back in march but does not
write march anywhere in her letter. Since the letter is actually a
warning letter for what happened back then now being my sons fault she
does'nt want to metion march because if what she is stating as fact now
she should have sent this warning letter back then. Anyway my son who
did'nt function well before this has really suffered a setback since
this whole thing happened and sold his car and stays in bed most of the
time. I know that when this originally happened the manager wrote an
inner office report that supported my sons having been a victim of this
landscape company. I know this because his neighbor that witnessed the
attack is also friends with the manager and she had let my sons neighbor
read this report. This girl told me the report totally controdicted
what the manager wrote months later after throwing my son out of the
office. My question is does my son have any right to request this
report originally written about these incidents when they happened ? I
was thinking it may be too late to pursue this matter in any other way
but my son needs some record that he reported this. The only letter he
has now supports the other sides view and while it may protect them it
totally covers up what really happened. The reason I think it's
important for my son to have this is I believe after enough time has
gone by the manager is going to try to make problems for my son so that
she can evict him. Also, just to keep some record that their's another
side to this.
Thanks For Reading And
Considering My Posting
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You haven't said what country, province, state, city you are in. How can
anybody help you without that information.
Your son may have rights under your country's disability-rights laws. A
local charity could help and advise.
Le 29/3/08 19:35, dans 10856-47EE9A1D-531@storefull-3131.bay.webtv.net, R
H <RH916@webtv.net> a crit:
My son is mentally disabled and has lived in the same apartment complex
for 28 years. In March of 2007 a landscape contractor employed by the
complex decided to start their job of cleaning the winter sand/salt from
the parking lots by covering my son and his car with sand. The complex
has 150 apartments and 600 parking spaces. These (8) guys including
and under the direction of the owner entered the area of buidings my son
lives in and saw him with his car hood up and in a bad position. Rather
than go to any border of this area and start there, they crossed 3
parking lots and 60 parking spaces to approach my son. The owner asked
my son if he could move his car even though he could see the battery was
removed (for charging). Oh, before I forget the apartment management
had not warned residents they would be doing this work and never have
till this year (March 2008) they gave all residents notice for the first
time in 28 years. Anyway when my son said he could'nt move his car the
owner ordered his crew to start their machines and they covered my son
and every exposed part of his car with sand. This took only a couple of
minutes and when they were done the owner told his crew to shut off
their machines. At that time my son said to him " why did you do this,
and is this the way you always treat poor people " the owner answered "
I am poor too but at least I work ". Then the owner and his crew
walked away and went to the border of the property and started his job
there. They never stopped again till they finished the whole 3 parking
lots
an hour later. My son was too scared to even call the police or report
what happened to the management till days later. When he reported to
the manager she said she believed my son and she would take care of it,
she also admitted to having a problem with a bigoted former head of
maintenance that hired the landscape company concerned. A week later
these guys from the landscape company were back at my sons 1st floor
window talking about commiting a hate crime towards him (my son). That
day my son went to report this to the manager again, and again she said
she would deal with it. She sent her head of maintenance to see the
landscape company owner and he denied that anything had happened. Oh,
this landscape company does the painting for the apartment complex also.
When the head of maintenace returned he told my son the only thing they
could do was warn my son whenever the landscapers would be on property.
So for the next six months my son left the property with his car every
tuesday. Yet the landscaper would come on any other day of the week
while my son was never warned. Everytime my son complained to management
about this they got more angry with him, telling my son it was becoming
a pain to need to warn him when they actually weren't even keeping their
own agreement to do so. Then at the end of August last year the
landscape company showed up on a friday without warning and came very
close to my son while he was outside with one of his neighbors. At that
point my son had not gone into the office for over a month but decided
to tell the manager about this latest event. When he went in the
manager took him into her office and immediately said " we have gone
above and beyond the call of duty for you ".
My son could not believe how insensitive she was being and asked her if
she would write what she said down. With that she started screaming at
my son to get out and as she opened her door to the open communitty room
with other residents present kept yelling get out, get out and she also
said she was gonna call her lawyer and the she corrected herself and
said our lawyer. My son left the building shaking. A week later he
received his first letter about what had happened last March but now
everthing was reversed actually blaming the victim for what had happened
because " he was working on his car ". The letter also told my son
they would no longer be tellng him when the landscapers were coming, and
that if my son did'nt know what day tuesday was he could remind himself
by marking it on the calender that the office sends out on their monthly
newsletter. This was belittling my son and anyway he had left the
property every tuesday whether he had been warned or not. The problem
was when they would show up on every other day other than tuesday and
their was no warning. Of course she does not mention this in her
letter. Also she refers to what happened back in march but does not
write march anywhere in her letter. Since the letter is actually a
warning letter for what happened back then now being my sons fault she
does'nt want to metion march because if what she is stating as fact now
she should have sent this warning letter back then. Anyway my son who
did'nt function well before this has really suffered a setback since
this whole thing happened and sold his car and stays in bed most of the
time. I know that when this originally happened the manager wrote an
inner office report that supported my sons having been a victim of this
landscape company. I know this because his neighbor that witnessed the
attack is also friends with the manager and she had let my sons neighbor
read this report. This girl told me the report totally controdicted
what the manager wrote months later after throwing my son out of the
office. My question is does my son have any right to request this
report originally written about these incidents when they happened ? I
was thinking it may be too late to pursue this matter in any other way
but my son needs some record that he reported this. The only letter he
has now supports the other sides view and while it may protect them it
totally covers up what really happened. The reason I think it's
important for my son to have this is I believe after enough time has
gone by the manager is going to try to make problems for my son so that
she can evict him. Also, just to keep some record that their's another
side to this.
Thanks For Reading And
Considering My Posting
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My son is mentally disabled and has lived in the same apartment complex
for 28 years. In March of 2007 a landscape contractor employed by the
complex decided to start their job of cleaning the winter sand/salt from
the parking lots by covering my son and his car with sand. The complex
has 150 apartments and 600 parking spaces. These (8) guys including
and under the direction of the owner entered the area of buidings my son
lives in and saw him with his car hood up and in a bad position. Rather
than go to any border of this area and start there, they crossed 3
parking lots and 60 parking spaces to approach my son. The owner asked
my son if he could move his car even though he could see the battery was
removed (for charging). Oh, before I forget the apartment management
had not warned residents they would be doing this work and never have
till this year (March 2008) they gave all residents notice for the first
time in 28 years. Anyway when my son said he could'nt move his car the
owner ordered his crew to start their machines and they covered my son
and every exposed part of his car with sand. This took only a couple of
minutes and when they were done the owner told his crew to shut off
their machines. At that time my son said to him " why did you do this,
and is this the way you always treat poor people " the owner answered "
I am poor too but at least I work ". Then the owner and his crew
walked away and went to the border of the property and started his job
there. They never stopped again till they finished the whole 3 parking
lots
an hour later. My son was too scared to even call the police or report
what happened to the management till days later. When he reported to
the manager she said she believed my son and she would take care of it,
she also admitted to having a problem with a bigoted former head of
maintenance that hired the landscape company concerned. A week later
these guys from the landscape company were back at my sons 1st floor
window talking about commiting a hate crime towards him (my son). That
day my son went to report this to the manager again, and again she said
she would deal with it. She sent her head of maintenance to see the
landscape company owner and he denied that anything had happened. Oh,
this landscape company does the painting for the apartment complex also.
When the head of maintenace returned he told my son the only thing they
could do was warn my son whenever the landscapers would be on property.
So for the next six months my son left the property with his car every
tuesday. Yet the landscaper would come on any other day of the week
while my son was never warned. Everytime my son complained to management
about this they got more angry with him, telling my son it was becoming
a pain to need to warn him when they actually weren't even keeping their
own agreement to do so. Then at the end of August last year the
landscape company showed up on a friday without warning and came very
close to my son while he was outside with one of his neighbors. At that
point my son had not gone into the office for over a month but decided
to tell the manager about this latest event. When he went in the
manager took him into her office and immediately said " we have gone
above and beyond the call of duty for you ".
My son could not believe how insensitive she was being and asked her if
she would write what she said down. With that she started screaming at
my son to get out and as she opened her door to the open communitty room
with other residents present kept yelling get out, get out and she also
said she was gonna call her lawyer and the she corrected herself and
said our lawyer. My son left the building shaking. A week later he
received his first letter about what had happened last March but now
everthing was reversed actually blaming the victim for what had happened
because " he was working on his car ". The letter also told my son
they would no longer be tellng him when the landscapers were coming, and
that if my son did'nt know what day tuesday was he could remind himself
by marking it on the calender that the office sends out on their monthly
newsletter. This was belittling my son and anyway he had left the
property every tuesday whether he had been warned or not. The problem
was when they would show up on every other day other than tuesday and
their was no warning. Of course she does not mention this in her
letter. Also she refers to what happened back in march but does not
write march anywhere in her letter. Since the letter is actually a
warning letter for what happened back then now being my sons fault she
does'nt want to metion march because if what she is stating as fact now
she should have sent this warning letter back then. Anyway my son who
did'nt function well before this has really suffered a setback since
this whole thing happened and sold his car and stays in bed most of the
time. I know that when this originally happened the manager wrote an
inner office report that supported my sons having been a victim of this
landscape company. I know this because his neighbor that witnessed the
attack is also friends with the manager and she had let my sons neighbor
read this report. This girl told me the report totally controdicted
what the manager wrote months later after throwing my son out of the
office. My question is does my son have any right to request this
report originally written about these incidents when they happened ? I
was thinking it may be too late to pursue this matter in any other way
but my son needs some record that he reported this. The only letter he
has now supports the other sides view and while it may protect them it
totally covers up what really happened. The reason I think it's
important for my son to have this is I believe after enough time has
gone by the manager is going to try to make problems for my son so that
she can evict him. Also, just to keep some record that their's another
side to this.
"does my son have any right to request this report"
Anybody can request anything.
Does your son have a right to the report if the request is refused?
No. Not unless your son sues. After a lawsuit is filed, a subpoena can be
issued for the report.
This answer must not be relied on as legal advice for the reasons posted
here: http://mcgyverdisclaimer.blogspot.com . And I am not your attorney.
McGyver
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Thanks Mcgyver:
It's been a year now since this happened and most of the public anti
discrimination, human rights groups say that too much time has passed
to do anything about this. Last week a human rights agency actually
told me it sounds like a personal issues between the apartment manager
and my son. Although things aren't good between them this is hardly the
real reason for going forward with this case and I could'nt believe
someone in that field would say such a thing ? Anyway do you think any
private attorney would be intersted in such a case ? and after a year
has gone by ? and what type of attorney would handle such a matter ?
Thanks Again .... Mcgyver
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Thanks Mcgyver:
It's been a year now since this happened and most of the public anti
discrimination, human rights groups say that too much time has passed
to do anything about this. Last week a human rights agency actually
told me it sounds like a personal issues between the apartment manager
and my son. Although things aren't good between them this is hardly the
real reason for going forward with this case and I could'nt believe
someone in that field would say such a thing ? Anyway do you think any
private attorney would be intersted in such a case ? and after a year
has gone by ? and what type of attorney would handle such a matter ?
Thanks Again .... Mcgyver
I don't know what you mean by "interested". If you mean would an attorney
take this case pro bono or on a contingency fee basis, I don't think so, but
there is no harm in asking. If you mean would an attorney take this case if
you paid hourly rates, the answer is yes. The type of attorney would be
civil litigation attorney.
This answer must not be relied on as legal advice for the reasons posted
here: http://mcgyverdisclaimer.blogspot.com . And I am not your attorney.
McGyver
y>
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Thanks Mcgyver .....
When you say it's possible a lawyer might take this on an hourly basis
when does paying him or her fall due ? and I guess that means my son
does not have much of a case ? I have never sued anyone so I don't
know how much we could get into here ? But seems stupid to spend $2,000
to win a $2,500 settlement so the attorney gets $2,000 and my son gets
$500. and then he gets booted from his home for filing such a case ?
Thanks Again Mcgyver
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Thanks Mcgyver .....
When you say it's possible a lawyer might take this on an hourly basis
when does paying him or her fall due ?
Payment is due in advance. The attorney would estimate the fees that would
be incurred in the first month or two and you would pay that amount in
advance. Then every month, as charges are incurred, payment would be taken
from that advance fund and you would receive an invoice asking you to
replentish the advance fund. In that way, every hour expended is paid for
in advance.
and I guess that means my son
does not have much of a case ?
I didn't say that. I don't remember what I told you about the quality of
the case back when you posted the facts and I considered them. If you want
to know what I think about the quality of the case, go back and read all of
my posts on that topic. But you are missing the point. A great case, a
can't-lose case, doesn't mean an attorney would take it on a contingency fee
basis or a pro bono basis. When I said I don't think this is a case an
attorney would take on a pro bono or on a contingency fee basis, I was not
referring to the quality of the case but on the type of case.
I have never sued anyone so I don't
know how much we could get into here ? But seems stupid to spend $2,000
to win a $2,500 settlement so the attorney gets $2,000 and my son gets
$500. and then he gets booted from his home for filing such a case ?
You are right, that wouldn't make sense. If I recall correctly, this is an
assault and battery case. My guess is that the total cost of taking it
through trial could be as low as $30,000. That is a totally wild guess,
because I don't even remember what state you are in and because i don't
remember the specific facts of the case.
That leaves small claims court. Your son might win in small claims if he
has evidence and can present the case in narative form and it is not too
late.
This answer must not be relied on as legal advice for the reasons posted
here: http://mcgyverdisclaimer.blogspot.com . And I am not your attorney.
McGyver
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Mcgyver ..... " could be as low as $30.000 " ??
Are you kidding ? or is their something I am missing here ? I can't
believe their are too many people that would bring suit at $30K ?
I guess the rights of just law is only for the wealthy ?
Thanks Mcgyver ......
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Justice is for the rich ... and for the very poor, if their cases are
"academically interesting". Contingency fees (or, in England,
"no-win-no-fee") will attract lawyers (and ambulance chasers) if the case is
easy and can be settled without trial -- even if the settlement is for a
fraction of its real worth.
Small claims court is the "people's court" and performs a real service in
diffusing cases that could otherwise lead to violence. After all, the
purpose of the Law is not to "do justice" but to "keep the peace".
Administrative and specialized courts also yield cheap, professional
resolution of issues (tax, immigration, housing, employment) even if one
side has to be pro-se (self-represented).
In England today a six-week trial can easily run up a bill of 1 million ($2
mn). The loser pays the costs (court, lawyers', everything) of both sides.
In the UK if one is represented by Legal Aid, they pay the costs in case of
loss. Similarly in no-win-no-fee but it is wildly improbable that a
solicitor would take on a case in which loss is feasible.
Many cases are simply not worth pursuing, even sad cases of total and
permanent crippling through medical malpractice. In states where there is a
cap ($250,000 in California) no lawyer will take the case because the cost
of litigation is likely to exceed that. Insurance companies force a trial
"pour encourager les autres".
See the "McLibel case for the longest-running English case ever, and one
where the defendants, sued by McDonalds for pamphleteering in front of a
McDo restaurant, lost. But, like Wal-Mart last week, McDo had so much egg on
their faces that they refrained from trying to collect. See:
http://McSpotlight.org
In both the US and the UK it may be necessary to post a bond (in the USA a
"supersedeas bond") before one can appeal.
$30,000 is cheap.
"No fault" laws are designed to make justice available cheaply to more
people. That was the idea of "workman's [now workers'] compensation" too.
But, as with Bhopal and Vacor and Thalidomide, and with all those US
class-action cases (especially Love Canal -- and the W.R. Grace case made
famous in the book/movie "A Civil Affair" -- the payout to the injured
parties is likely to be trivial. In US class actions the only ones who get
decent compensation are the lawyers. Yet the arrogance of these guys --
think of Scruggs
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/15/business/15scruggs.html
Makes them do crazy things. Like bribing judges.
On 06/04/2008 02:33, in article
1989-47F82874-1007@storefull-3134.bay.webtv.net, "rog350@webtv.net"
<rog350@webtv.net> wrote:
Mcgyver ..... " could be as low as $30.000 " ??
Are you kidding ? or is their something I am missing here ? I can't
believe their are too many people that would bring suit at $30K ?
I guess the rights of just law is only for the wealthy ?
Thanks Mcgyver ......
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Yeah but I imagine that $30,000 is if this matter is not settled out of
court long before it gets there ??
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