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Material Man Lein issue



j.keene@bresnan.net (Joe)
12/2/2004 4:49:00 PM


Hello -
I hired a contractor (based on a friends reccomendation) and the
contractor turned out to be a nightmare. The contract was basic, and
does not have anything about dispute resolution or leins. This
contractor also is not licensed and has no insurance. He claimed to
be insured at the time of the contract signing and promised all
workers would have workmans comp.
He starts off with a crew of 4 children ( aged 8-18 ) I said nothing
in hopes of him finishing the job and leaving in a couple weeks.
Anyway, I'm fairly certain that an 8 year old is not covered with
workmans comp. Luckily, there were no injuries.
The addition fails framing inspection with 10+ Building departement
red tags, and the contractor just ignores them and continues with
siding, etc. He claimed the building department was full of sXXt.
One day later, the contractor tells me he needs an extra $1,000 from
me because he 'bid the siding cost incorrectly'. After a short
argument over cost and the very poor quality of workmanship, he leaves
the job site with his tools and a few of mine... And does not return.
Two weeks later, I get a notice of intent to lein from his lawyer
(claiming breach of contract and that he was thrown off the job site).
This lein has not been filed yet.
A couple months later (last week), I get a notice of intent to lein
from the material provider (approx $5K). I requested the list of
materials I owe them for and recieved a list of only items that are
not yet paid for. I am amazed that the list contains things such as
Diet Coke's, Sawblades, Spray foam, cement as well as other things
that are definately not on the property.
My questions:
Does an inaccurate list of materials affect or invalidate a material
lein?
They gave the contractor credit, which accrued interest. Can they
pass the interest and late charges over to me?
The contractor was over paid when he left ($25k of $35k contract)...
Am I still liable to the material provider? I think I have to pay for
the material and sue the contractor... But, I think the contractor
has little money.
Please and thanks for your help!
StupidHomeowner
 
 
"Scott Hedrick"
12/6/2004 10:03:24 AM




"Joe" <j.keene@bresnan.net> wrote in message
news:e5puq0p7sc5aem9u4cmhp6g3sr5t9ni03h@4ax.com...

This
contractor also is not licensed and has no insurance.
Many states do not allow unlicensed contractors to legally enforce
collection.
He starts off with a crew of 4 children ( aged 8-18 ) I said nothing
in hopes of him finishing the job and leaving in a couple weeks.
On the other hand, you need to have clean hands. It sounds as if you
knowingly allowed the contractor to work with clearly illegal labor. This
may very well negate any claims you have against the contractor.
Anyway, I'm fairly certain that an 8 year old is not covered with
workmans comp. Luckily, there were no injuries.
Lucky for *you*, since this would almost certainly not have been covered
under your homeowner's policy.
One day later, the contractor tells me he needs an extra $1,000 from
me because he 'bid the siding cost incorrectly'.
That really shouldn't be your problem.
Two weeks later, I get a notice of intent to lein from his lawyer
(claiming breach of contract and that he was thrown off the job site).
This lein has not been filed yet.
Tell the attorney that the contractor is unlicensed and that if a lien is
filed, you will consider a suit against the contractor and his attorney for
slander of title.
A couple months later (last week), I get a notice of intent to lein
from the material provider (approx $5K). I requested the list of
materials I owe them for and recieved a list of only items that are
not yet paid for.
If the items were paid for, there's no reason for the material supplier to
include them on the list of items owed for. Even if there were additional
items left unpaid, if they aren't included on the list it won't negate the
rest of the claim.
I am amazed that the list contains things such as
Diet Coke's, Sawblades, Spray foam, cement as well as other things
that are definately not on the property.
That may very well be up to you to prove if you contest the lien.
Does an inaccurate list of materials affect or invalidate a material
lein?
No, since it can be corrected.
They gave the contractor credit, which accrued interest. Can they
pass the interest and late charges over to me?
It depends on state law, but it may very well.
The contractor was over paid when he left ($25k of $35k contract)...
Am I still liable to the material provider?
Almost certainly.
I think I have to pay for
the material and sue the contractor... But, I think the contractor
has little money.
That happens. Hopefully you have pictures of the underage employees to pass
on to the labor board and worker's comp folks.
Did you have a permit if one was necessary? You may well find out that, not
only do you have to pay for the materials, but that you'll have to tear down
what was build (and get a permit for *that*).
Think how much money you save by using an unlicensed contractor.
 
 
"j.keene"
12/7/2004 9:52:20 PM


I am amazed that the list contains things such as
That may very well be up to you to prove if you contest the lien.
Will do. Thank you.
Hopefully you have pictures of the underage employees to pass
on to the labor board and worker's comp folks.
I have pictures... Good thinking!
Did you have a permit if one was necessary? You may well find out
that, not
only do you have to pay for the materials, but that you'll have to
tear down
what was build (and get a permit for *that*).
Yes, I have a permit. The framining inspection failed with 14 red tags
that I have since photographed and fixed. I expect to get through the
final inspection this month ( maybe next month ).
Think how much money you save by using an unlicensed contractor.
It's clear that I made a gross mistake by hiring this guy. At the
time, I was thinking that "Friend_Of_A_Friend +
reccomendation_From_Same_Friend = Friend"... And I thought that this
contractor, needing a start in this town, would give his best effort.
Instead, he used his skills to cut corners and save $$$ on materials
and labor. I *think* I've learned my lesson.
I appreciate your help, thanks,
StupidHomeowner
 
 
"j.keene"
12/14/2004 7:13:38 AM


of representative democracy essentially
similar to that of the United States. If the Founding Fathers had lost
their nerve and declined to sign the Declaration of Independence, our
way of life today would not have been significantly different. Maybe
we would have had somewhat closer ties to Britain, and would have had
a Parliament and Prime Minister instead of a Congress and President.
No big deal. Thus the American Revolution provides not a
counterexample to our principles but a good illustration of them.

110. Still, one has to use common sense in applying the principles.
They are expressed in imprecise language that allows latitude for
interpretation, and exceptions to them can be found. So we present
these principles not as inviolable laws but as rules of thumb, or
guides to thinking, that may provide a partial antidote to naive ideas
about the future of society. The principles should be borne constantly
in mind, and whenever one reaches a conclusion that conflicts with
them one should carefully reexamine one's thinking and retain the
conclusion
 
 
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