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I will try to make this short, which is not easy:
In June 2001, after selling my home, I stored all of my possessions
with Public Storage via their "crate" service. While loading one of the
filled crates with a forklift, the operator dropped the crate in the
street, destroying most of the contents. After speaking with a Public
Storage manager by phone, I was told that I should file a claim for
damages and possibly consult an attorney specializing in such
contractual matters. Being very upset with the course of events, I told
this representative that I would withhold payment until the claim was
processed (I knew of no other recourse and this seemed like a
reasonable impetus for the company to process the claim in a timely
manner). The representative told me that she understood and would
follow the same course of action if she were in my shoes. The forklift
operator was replaced by a more experienced employee, and the other
crates were lifted onto the rig.
As previously arranged, after the sale of my home was complete, I spent
approximately 2 months with family in Florida prior to the close of
escrow on my new house. I informed Public Storage that I was taking
this trip and that I would return to California in late August 2001.
After returning to California and moving into my new home in Berkeley,
I contacted Public Storage to 1) arrange the delivery of my items, and
2) arrange a meeting with a contract specialist to process the pending
claim. I was told by a representative that she needed to "pull" the
paperwork and call me back in the afternoon. I told her that would be
fine. I did not hear from her that afternoon. The following day I again
contacted this representative to check status. After putting me on hold
for a few minutes, she returned to tell me that ALL of my belongings
had been auctioned that very morning. I firmly expressed my disbelief
and reminded her that she had promised to call me back the previous
day, which she did not do. At that point she again placed me on hold. A
few minutes later a man picked up the line, claiming to be the site
supervisor. He informed me there was nothing he could do, he could not
reveal the identities of the buyers of my belongings, and the sale was
final. Still in disbelief and verging on hysteria, I tried to inform
him of the circumstances and the prior day's call to his employee, at
which point he told me my best bet would be to get a lawyer and never
call back. He used a very derogatory term for "homosexual" at this
point, and hung up the phone.
I have retained all of the paperwork, notes, photographs of the
original damaged crate, as well as a full hand-written inventory of the
packaged items. I would very much appreciate any advice in this matter.
Thank you for your time-
C
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In article <u1in21pkquoqino3fpi4rbt7fosbe11v6p@4ax.com>,
"schmolin" <colin@atlantic.net> wrote:
I have retained all of the paperwork, notes, photographs of the
original damaged crate, as well as a full hand-written inventory of the
packaged items. I would very much appreciate any advice in this matter.
Notes, photos, and paperwork doesn't mean that much in this
case. What matters is the contract. What does the contract
say? If it says that they can sell your stuff in the event
of non-payment, then you are pretty well at the end of your
line. You might want to see if there was any notice period
required--in some states, they need to notify you or serve
papers before going to auction.
-john-
--
======================================================================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708 john@johnweeks.com
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
======================================================================
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On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 22:21:29 -0500, "schmolin" <colin@atlantic.net>
wrote:
I will try to make this short, which is not easy:
[Storage facility dropped a crate from crane while loading poster's storage
unit. Poster complained and told claims rep that payment would be
withheld until claim resolved. Claims rep said she would do the same thing
in poster's situation. Poster notified facility of pending travel out of state.
On return, called to arrange transfer and was informed the contents were being
auctioned that day, then called a rude epithet and hung up on.]
Contact a local lawyer with experience in debtor-creditor matters.
Daniel Reitman
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Being very upset with the course of events, I told
this representative that I would withhold payment until the claim was
processed (I knew of no other recourse and this seemed like a
reasonable impetus for the company to process the claim in a timely
manner).
Well, when you go to court with your return receipt for the certified mail
you sent to explain your situation, you might have a chance.
You *did* follow up the conversation with a letter sent via certified mail,
return receipt requested, didn't you? Otherwise, what evidence do you have
that the conversation even took place?
More to the point, what does your written contract state about withholding
rent?
As to getting your stuff back, even if you had a list of buyers and could
contact them, it's not your stuff anymore. Unless you're prepared to show
that the buyers knew that the seller did not have the authority to sell them
(and that's in dispute), they did nothing wrong, and as innocent third
parties, you don't have the right to injure *them* by taking the stuff. At
the very least, you could expect to compensate them what they paid for the
items..
From your description, you have two *separate* problems- the damage to your
items by their forklift operator, and *your* willful failure to pay rent,
for which Public Storage rightfully sold your items.
When you show the judge the receipts where you paid the rent in escrow in
anticipation of resolving the problem, you *might* be able to show that you
did not intend to defraud Public Storage. After all, once your claim with
them for damage was resolved, you'd owe the full amount of back rent, and
placing it in escrow shows that you're not just trying to avoid payment.
Unfortunately, almost nobody who withholds rent makes arrangements with the
court clerk to hold the money in escrow, so a judge is justified in assuming
you wanted something for nothing.
Remember, *you* tried to connect your damage claim to your willful refusal
to pay rent, but neither the courts nor Public Storage is required to do so,
and the statement by the representative that she didn't blame you *is not* a
binding agreement on the part of Public Storage to accept deferred rent.
Almost certainly, there is a provision in your rental agreement that says
the written agreement constitutes the *totality of the contract*, and no
oral modification is valid. It probably also limits the people who are
authorized to make changes (probably to an officer of the corporation).
In short, you seem to have a valid claim for the damage done to the original
crate. You don't seem to have much of a claim for your other belongings
because you didn't pay rent. In fact, it's entirely possible that even your
claim for the damaged goods might be tossed out of court, because, if they
had not been damaged, you would have stored them, and you willingly failed
to pay rent on your storage. The *reason* you refused to pay rent on the
undamaged goods is likely irrelevant, unless there is a clause in the rental
contract allowing the joinder of these separate matters. Your description of
the events, and your failure to follow up with a written notice, makes it
sound as if *you* acted in an unreasonable matter.
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On Sun, 06 Mar 2005, "schmolin" <colin@atlantic.net> wrote:
[ In June 2001, I stored all of my possessions with
Public Storage via their "crate" service. While loading
my belongings, they dropped one crate, destroying most
of its contents. A manager told me by phone that I should
file a claim for damages and possibly consult lawyer, and
I replied that I would withhold payment until the claim
was processed. ]
Did you actually make a claim in accordance with whatever were the
procedures to which you agreed in/by your storage/carting contract, or
do you mean by "claim" just what you said to the representative on the
phone?
I knew of no other recourse and this seemed like
a reasonable impetus for the company to process
the claim in a timely manner.
Is your saying that you did not know of any other recourse than
unilaterally deciding to withhold payments another way to say that you
did not actually make a claim as and when provided by your contract?
[ I then left the state for more than 2 month. ]
Did you stay at an address you furnished to the storage company?
What if anything did you do to try to insure that notices mailed to
you at whatever was the address you supplied would be actually
forwarded to you while you were away from Calif. for more than two
months?
[ After returning to California in late August 2001,
I called Public Storage toarrange the delivery
of my items and arrange a meeting with a contract
specialist to process the pending claim. ]
If you had chosen to absent yourself from the state for more than two
months, what made you think that there was a claim that was pending?
If there really was a claim pending, (if there was one other than the
telephone hang-up more than two years ago to which you go on to refer)
what was the storage company's response to it?
[ The representative replied she needed get my
file and would call me back later that day but she
did not call back that day and, when I called the next
day, I was told that all my belongings had been
auctioned that very morning. Someone who then
identified himself as a supervisor got on the
phone, said there was nothing he could do, we
exchaged invectives and insults, then he hung up
the phone. I would very much appreciate any advice.
Thank you.]
What did the storage company do (exactly) that violated what
provisions of its agreement with you (exactly)?
What have you learned about where if at all the storage company
notified you of its intent to enforce its lien and what if anything is
wrong with the storage company's contentions in this connection?
What have you done in the years and months that have elapsed since
Aug. 2001 actually to make and pursue a claim?
Possibly, it is too late now to do anything; but, maybe, it isn't (too
late); and, maybe, you have any number of still viable claims,
although whether only (or not at all) for breach of contract,
negligence, conversion, or maybe on some others, isn't determinable,
much less is "advice" as such (that would be reliable) enabled,
without (at least) specific credible/provable answers to all the
questions above.
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I informed Public Storage that I was taking
this trip and that I would return to California in late August 2001.
So, you went out of state for two months, during which time all your
stuff got auctioned off.
The question is: was the storage facility allowed to auction your stuff
off without informing you first? Probably not. However, they may have
"informed" you by mailing you a letter--- and unless you arranged to
have your mail forwarded to California, it would not have been possible
for you to get the letter.
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schmolin wrote:
I will try to make this short, which is not easy:
As previously arranged, after the sale of my home was complete, I
spent
approximately 2 months with family in Florida prior to the close of
escrow on my new house. I informed Public Storage that I was taking
this trip and that I would return to California in late August 2001.
After returning to California and moving into my new home in
Berkeley,
I contacted Public Storage to 1) arrange the delivery of my items,
and
2) arrange a meeting with a contract specialist to process the
pending
claim. I was told by a representative that she needed to "pull" the
paperwork and call me back in the afternoon.
This is a common theme on this newsgroup. Someone goes out of town for
a while and when they come back he/she is shocked to discover someone
else has done something undesirable to him/her in his/her absence. In
this case, Schmolin was at least able to inform the other party that he
was in fact leaving town.
However, out of town is not the same thing as "incommunicado." Yes,
Schmolin was in Florida, but that does not necessarily mean that he
couldn't have stayed in touch with the storage facility in California.
Unless you are being held in the internment camp at Guantanamo Bay, you
can always tell folks where you are. (Even in Gitmo, you do get the
occasionbal visit from the Red Cross.) You can even arrange to have
mail forwarded to you. At the very least, if you are truly are
incommunicado, you can tell folks that you will be incommunicado for a
while and make arrangements for dealing with foreseeable emergencies
(such as, for example, the possibility that the storage place would
start threatening to auction your stuff off after you left it there
without paying.)
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