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I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
--
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time
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I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
Why on earth would a judge want to accept your credit when you
admit not having enough money to pay the fine? A promissory note
is pointless if the credit of the promiser sucks.
Gordon L. Burditt
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I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will
allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
Why on earth would a judge want to accept your credit when you
admit not having enough money to pay the fine? A promissory note
is pointless if the credit of the promiser sucks.
Gordon L. Burditt
I asked a question, and you answered with a question? Perhaps the amount
money I have or don't have is not relevant. My question is can the Judge
demand payment of a fine with credit?
I don't know how to ask this question any more simply than this. If you
can't or don't know how to answer the question don't waste the bandwidth.
Robert Miller
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In article <6NidnQQUWLDSdziiRVn-ug@comcast.com>, "Robert Miller"
<rmiller0100@comcast.net> wrote:
I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will
allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
I asked a question, and you answered with a question? Perhaps the amount
money I have or don't have is not relevant. My question is can the Judge
demand payment of a fine with credit?
I don't know how to ask this question any more simply than this. If you
can't or don't know how to answer the question don't waste the bandwidth.
Robert Miller
More likely will be that the judge will set a date in the future, by which
payment must be made. If its not made by that date, some courts enter a
civil judgment for tbe money, and it will show up as an unpaid debt on
your credit report.
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In article <6NidnQQUWLDSdziiRVn-ug@comcast.com>, "Robert Miller"
<rmiller0100@comcast.net> wrote:
More likely will be that the judge will set a date in the future, by which
payment must be made. If its not made by that date, some courts enter a
civil judgment for tbe money, and it will show up as an unpaid debt on
your credit report.
This is interesting a traffic fine is a debt. If someone does not pay
their
fine / debt they can go to jail / debtor's prison?
This still did not answer my question. I have heard that a Judge can not
demand somebody pay a fine / debt with credit. Is this true?
Is this such a hard concept to understand?
Robert Miller
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In article <nLWdnUnxTdRxfDiiRVn-jA@comcast.com> "Robert Miller" <rmiller0100@comcast.net> writes:
I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
You asked this same question back in May 2002 and February 2003.
It turned into a discussion of your crackpot theories of whether a
"Federal Reserve Note" is a promissory note. Why don't you just
reread that thread instead of bothering everybody again?
Please don't feed this troll!
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Lee,
Thanks for citing the posts. I also remember Mr. Miller asking this
question in the past. He expresses odd notions of money and is attempting to
sell "silver certificates" made by some non-governmental group. I urge that
people compare the price of silver on the open market to Mr. Miller's price.
I believe that you are correct that this is a troll. Even if one agrees
with Miller's theory of money buying his certificates is a losing
proposition.
Dave M.
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Robert Miller wrote:
I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will
allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard
that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
Not likely.
You were given plenty of advance notice to have the money in hand by the
court date.
No money, go to jail.
--
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time
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I don't know how to ask this question any more simply than this. If
you
can't or don't know how to answer the question don't waste the
bandwidth.
I didn't seem clear to me. At first you asked if "if the Judge will
allow" you to pay with a note.
In the next paragraph you say you thought judges were prohibited from
"demanding" same.
The former part suggests you are requesting permission to do
something. The latter part suggests you are being ordered to do
something. These are not the same thing.
Perhaps you can rephrase the question, and fill it in with some case
facts to put the question in context.
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Robert Miller wrote:
Not likely.
You were given plenty of advance notice to have the money in hand by the
court date.
No money, go to jail.
In fact I have paid traffic fines with and am on Record for paying traffic
fines
with NORFED's Silver Libertys in Habersham County Courthouse.
I've also paid my water bill in the Clayton Georgia City Hall with Silver
Libertys
and Silver Warehouse Receipts.
A seperate note, I was asked to redeem Silver Libertys and Warehouse
receipts
by the Walmart in Fort Wayne Indiana. I spend them and I redeem them as do
thousands of other people. The numbers grow every week for the number of
redemption centers around the country.
BTW a Judge will dismiss a case rather than demand someone pay with Federal.
That would be a felony :-)
--
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time
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Robert Miller wrote:
In fact I have paid traffic fines with and am on Record for paying
traffic
fines
with NORFED's Silver Libertys in Habersham County Courthouse.
I've also paid my water bill in the Clayton Georgia City Hall with
Silver
Libertys
and Silver Warehouse Receipts.
A seperate note, I was asked to redeem Silver Libertys and Warehouse
receipts
by the Walmart in Fort Wayne Indiana. I spend them and I redeem them
as do
thousands of other people. The numbers grow every week for the number
of
redemption centers around the country.
BTW a Judge will dismiss a case rather than demand someone pay with
Federal.
That would be a felony :-)
I seriously doubt all of it.
Unless money is printed and distributed by the United States government, it
is not "legal tender".
That would be like trying to pay a fine with Monopoly money.
Unless an act of Congress authorizes the legal public use, it's no good.
What you are doing, from what I understand at the website, is basically
buying "stock" and trading it around as if it were real money.
Kind of like buying a money order, or "travelers checks".
If a court does accept such a thing, then what they do is exchange it back
for the actual legal cash.
There's no way you could take this stuff to your bank and deposit it in your
account.
Oh yeah, one attorney's legal opinion on the legitimacy don't mean the stuff
is "legal tender".
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you
bandwidth.
I didn't seem clear to me. At first you asked if "if the Judge will
allow" you to pay with a note.
In the next paragraph you say you thought judges were prohibited from
"demanding" same.
The former part suggests you are requesting permission to do
something. The latter part suggests you are being ordered to do
something. These are not the same thing.
Perhaps you can rephrase the question, and fill it in with some case
facts to put the question in context.
Fair enough.
"You honor does my fine Constitute a debt?"
Yes!
"Will you accept a promissory note in lieu of tender in payment of
my fine?"
No! I will not accept a promissory note.
"How would you like my to pay my fine?"
Since Art. I Sec. X of the U.S. Constitution forbids that States from
accepting anything but silver and gold as tender in payment of debt has
not been amended or repealed.
I was allowed to pay my fine in Specie at the Habersham County
Courthouse in N.E. Georgia.
My Silver was not U.S. Legal Tender Coins, but Silver Libertys I obtained
from NORFED at www.norfed.org a non-profit organization working to
return the United States to an honest economic system where a Dollar is a
Dollar. Not an unbacked defective promissory note, or token coinage.
So we know what we are talking about.
DOLLAR, money. A silver coin of the United States of the value of one
hundred cents, or
tenth part of an eagle.
2. It weighs four hundred and twelve and a half grains. Of one thousand
parts, nine hundred
are of pure silver and one hundred of alloy. Act of January 18, 1837, ss. 8
& 9, 4 Sharsw.
Cont. of Story's L. U. S. 2523, 4; Wright, R. 162.
TOKEN, commercial law. In England, this name is given to pieces of metal,
made in the shape
of money, passing among private persons by consent at a certain value. 2
Adolph. P. S. 175; 2
Chit. Com. Law, 182.
PROMISSORY NOTE, contracts. A written promise to pay a certain sum of money,
at a future
time, unconditionally. 7 Watts & S. 264; 2 Humph. R. 143; 10 Wend. 675;
Minor, R. 263; 7 Misso.
42; 2 Cowen, 536; 6 N. H. Rep. 364; 7 Vern. 22. A promissory note differs
from a mere
acknowledgment of debt, without any promise to pay, as when the debtor gives
his creditor an I 0 U.
(q.v.) See 2 Yerg. 50; 15 M. & W. 23. But see 2 Humph. 143; 6 Alab. R. 373.
In its form it usually contains a promise to pay, at a time therein
expressed, a sum of money to a
certain person therein named, or to his order, for value received. It is
dated and signed by the maker.
It is never under seal.
2. He who makes the promise is called the maker, and he to whom it is made
is the payee. Bayley
on Bills, 1; 3 Kent, Com, 46.
3. Although a promissory note, in its original shape, bears no resemblance
to a bill of exchange; yet,
when indorsed, it is exactly similar to one; for then it is an order by the
indorser of the note upon the
maker to pay to the indorsee. The indorser is as it were the drawer; the
maker, the acceptor; and the
indorsee, the payee. 4 Burr. 669; 4 T. R. 148; Burr. 1224.
4. Most of the rules applicable to bills of exchange, equally affect
promissory notes. No particular
form is requisite to these instruments; a promise to deliver the money, or
to be accountable for it,
or that the payee shall have it, is sufficient. Chit. on Bills, 53, 54.
5. There are two principal qualities essential to the validity of a note;
first, that it be payable at all
events, not dependent on any contingency; 20 Pick. 132; 22 Pick. 132 nor
payable out of any particular
fund. 3 J. J. Marsh. 542; 5 Pike, R. 441; 2 Blackf. 48; 1 Bibb, 503; 1 S. M.
393; 3 J. J. Marsh. 170; 3
Pick. R. 541; 4 Hawks, 102; 5 How. S. C. R. 382. And, secondly, it is
required that it be for the payment
of money only; 10 Serg. & Rawle, 94; 4 Watts, R. 400; 11 Verm. R. 268; and
not in bank notes, though it
has been held differently in the state of New York. 9 Johns. R. 120; 19
Johns. R. 144.
Notice "And, secondly, it is required that it be for the payment of money
only, and not in bank notes"
MONEY. Gold, silver, and some other less precious metals, in the progress of
civilization and commerce,
have become the common standards of value; in order to avoid the delay and
inconvenience of regulating
their weight and quality whenever passed, the governments of the civilized
world have caused them to be
manufactured in certain portions, and marked with a Stamp which attests
their value; this is called money.
1 Inst. 207; 1 Hale's Hist. 188; 1 Pardess. n. 22; Dom. Lois civ. liv. prel.
t. 3, s. 2, n. 6.
2. For many purposes, bank notes; (q.v.) 1 Y. & J, 380; 3 Mass. 405; 14
Mass. 122; 2 N. H. Rep. 333;
17 Mass. 560; 7 Cowen, 662; 4 Pick. 74; Bravt. 24; a check; 4 Bing. 179; S.
C. 13 E. C. L. R. 295; and
negotiable notes; 3 Mass. 405; will be so considered. To support a count for
money had and received,
the receipt by the defendant of bank notes, promissory notes: 3 Mass. 405; 3
Shepl. 285; 9 Pick. 93; John.
132; credit in account, in the books of a third person; 3 Campb. 199; or any
chattel, is sufficient; 4 Pick. 71;
17 Mass. 560; and will be treated as money. See 7 Wend. 311; 8 Wend. 641; 7
S. & R. 246; 8 T. R. 687; 3
B. & P. 559; 1 Y. & J. 380.
3. The constitution of the United States has vested in congress the power
"to coin money, and regulate the
value thereof." Art. 1, s. 8.
All definitions from
http://www.constitution.org/bouv/bouvier.htm
A LAW DICTIONARY ADAPTED TO THE CONSTITUTION AND LAWS OF
THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND OF THE SEVERAL STATES OF
THE AMERICAN UNION
With References to the Civil and Other Systems of Foreign Law
by John Bouvier
I might be a hardline conservative on the subject, but I'm not so
ignorant and some would like me to be.
Robert Miller
Helping to bring America back to value $1 at a time.
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Robert Miller wrote:
Not likely.
You were given plenty of advance notice to have the money in hand by the
court date.
No money, go to jail.
Should that have happened when you were evicted and lied about paying the
judgement, Deadbeat?
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From: "Richard" <anonymous@informant.sux>
Newsgroups: misc.legal
Subject: Re: Will the Judge accept a promissory note in payment of a traffic
fine?
Date: Mon, 3 Nov 2003 09:15:12 -0600
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No, the judge will not accept a promissory note. Cash for
certain; check or credit card if your jurisdiction allows them.
--
Brett
*****************************************************************
* Personal Injury/Malpractice Bankruptcy *
* *
* BRETT WEISS, P.C. *
* Attorneys at Law *
* Maryland, D.C. and Federal Bars *
* lawyer@erols.com *
* http://www.erols.com/lawyer *
* *
* Small Business Estates & Estate Planning *
*****************************************************************
The Small Print: This response is for discussion purposes only.
It isn't meant to be legal advice and you shouldn't treat it as
such. If you want legal advice, speak with a local lawyer
familiar with your state's laws who can review *all* of the facts
and the law applicable to your situation.
*****************************************************************
I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the
Judge will allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have
heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
--
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time
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In article <NJ6dncwd7LyNPTuiRVn-sQ@comcast.com>,
"Robert Miller" <rmiller0100@comcast.net> wrote:
"wg bradley" <wgb@bogus.ca> wrote in message
Fair enough.
"You honor does my fine Constitute a debt?"
Yes!
"Will you accept a promissory note in lieu of tender in payment of
my fine?"
No! I will not accept a promissory note.
I bet I know where this is going.
"How would you like my to pay my fine?"
Since Art. I Sec. X of the U.S. Constitution forbids that States from
accepting anything but silver and gold as tender in payment of debt has
not been amended or repealed.
Gee, I was right.
Article I, Section X says absolutely nothing of the kind. It doesn't
mention "accepting" anything at all.
It says
No State shall ... make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in
Payment of Debts.
The state didn't make "Federal Reserve Notes" tender. The federal
government did.
---------------------------------------------
David M. Nieporent nieporen@alumni.princeton.edu
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In article <NJ6dncwd7LyNPTuiRVn-sQ@comcast.com>,
"Robert Miller" <rmiller0100@comcast.net> wrote:
I bet I know where this is going.
Gee, I was right.
Article I, Section X says absolutely nothing of the kind. It doesn't
mention "accepting" anything at all.
It says
No State shall ... make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in
Payment of Debts.
The state didn't make "Federal Reserve Notes" tender. The federal
government did.
Which they had every authority to do within Federal Jurisdiction but
the federal government did not have the authority to make Federal Reserve
Notes legal tender in the States.
Washington D.C. residents are not protected by the United States
Constitution. The Congress has direct jurisdiction over Washington
D.C. and all Federal territories including Guam and American Samoa.
The Constitution is between the States and the Federal government
which is as a foriegn government in relation to the States.
For the priviledge of discharging our debts with Federal Reserve Notes
we each become personally liable for the national debt.
I understand you are a lawyer and I am familiar with the long historical
relationship between Banks and the Judiciary over the last 400 some
years.
The American economy is based on faith. Faith that the Dollar will
hold it's value over the long run. The Dollar took a beating because
of a hand full of terrorists on September 11. The Dollar is worth what
people think it's worth. Argentina's Peso same thing. If Argentina's
Peso was backed by Silver the Peso could not fall to a value below it's
silver backing.
What would the Dollar be worth if it were the same dollar
defined in 1790?
If 3% of the American people went to the banks and pulled out 100%
of their money today, there would be a banking holiday tomarrow, as
in 1933. Seems a pretty fine line to operate an economy on. Don't you
think?
Robert Miller
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
---------------------------------------------
David M. Nieporent nieporen@alumni.princeton.edu
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Robert Miller wrote:
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Does my fine constitute a debt? with the State.
Should that have happened when you were evicted and lied about paying the
judgement, Deadbeat?
It all depends of the definition of money and of the laws. In fact given
the
oppertunity I would feel the need to subpeona an expert on the law. I think
the prosicutor should be a very good witness to ask questions of a
constitutional
nature about the federal and state constitutions before a jury.
Robert Miller
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
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No, the judge will not accept a promissory note. Cash for
certain; check or credit card if your jurisdiction allows them.
--
Brett
Understand the actuall definition of the words you use.
CASH, commerce. Money on hand, which a merchant, trader or other person has
to do business
with.
2. Cash price, in contracts, is the price of articles paid for in cash, in
contradistinction to the credit
price. Pard. n. 85; Chipm. Contr. 110. In common parlance, bank notes are
considered as cash; but
bills receivable are not.
Money on hand is silver or gold. In a strict sence of the word
the is little or no real cash in circulation in America.
If we have to liberalize the definitions of the words and concepts
of our laws dealing with and about money. In order to change the
meaning of the law without changing the law itself many have told
me this is a valid way to change the law, but I don't agree.
*****************************************************************
* Personal Injury/Malpractice Bankruptcy *
* *
* BRETT WEISS, P.C. *
* Attorneys at Law *
* Maryland, D.C. and Federal Bars *
* lawyer@erols.com *
* http://www.erols.com/lawyer *
* *
* Small Business Estates & Estate Planning *
*****************************************************************
The Small Print: This response is for discussion purposes only.
It isn't meant to be legal advice and you shouldn't treat it as
such. If you want legal advice, speak with a local lawyer
familiar with your state's laws who can review *all* of the facts
and the law applicable to your situation.
*****************************************************************
Judge will allow
heard that
Robert Miller
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Does my fine constitute a debt? with the State.
It all depends of the definition of money and of the laws. In fact given
the
oppertunity I would feel the need to subpeona an expert on the law. I
think
the prosicutor should be a very good witness to ask questions of a
constitutional
nature about the federal and state constitutions before a jury.
You know, Bob, you constitutional law k00ks creep me the @$#* out. Do you
know the Kazoo? Does your place of employment pay you in that fake Liberty
money?
Robert Miller
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
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think
You know, Bob, you constitutional law k00ks creep me the @$#* out. Do you
know the Kazoo? Does your place of employment pay you in that fake Liberty
money?
I have been paid with Silver Libertys. I can not take all my pay in Silver
Libertys. I would not mind receiving 25% of my pay that way. Some places
do
not mind saving saving as much as 10% on my payroll.
Since I have very little trouble spending them for gas, groceries,
autoparts,
even traffic fines. I just can't expect to spend them everywhere.
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You asked a question; I gave a correct answer.
The fact that you want a different answer, or to use your
question to further your political agenda does not interest me.
--
Brett
*****************************************************************
* Personal Injury/Malpractice Bankruptcy *
* *
* BRETT WEISS, P.C. *
* Attorneys at Law *
* Maryland, D.C. and Federal Bars *
* lawyer@erols.com *
* http://www.erols.com/lawyer *
* *
* Small Business Estates & Estate Planning *
*****************************************************************
The Small Print: This response is for discussion purposes only.
It isn't meant to be legal advice and you shouldn't treat it as
such. If you want legal advice, speak with a local lawyer
familiar with your state's laws who can review *all* of the facts
and the law applicable to your situation.
*****************************************************************
Understand the actuall definition of the words you use.
CASH, commerce. Money on hand, which a merchant, trader or
other person has
to do business
with.
2. Cash price, in contracts, is the price of articles paid for
in cash, in
contradistinction to the credit
price. Pard. n. 85; Chipm. Contr. 110. In common parlance, bank
notes are
considered as cash; but
bills receivable are not.
Money on hand is silver or gold. In a strict sence of the word
the is little or no real cash in circulation in America.
If we have to liberalize the definitions of the words and
concepts
of our laws dealing with and about money. In order to change
the
meaning of the law without changing the law itself many have
told
me this is a valid way to change the law, but I don't agree.
Robert Miller
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I have been paid with Silver Libertys. I can not take all my pay in
Silver
Libertys. I would not mind receiving 25% of my pay that way. Some places
do
not mind saving saving as much as 10% on my payroll.
Since I have very little trouble spending them for gas, groceries,
autoparts,
even traffic fines. I just can't expect to spend them everywhere.
Yeah, I guess that 100% mark-up over the price of the silver puts a damper
on universal acceptance. They are pretty, though.
Robert Miller
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
And having fun doing it!
Fun is good, Bob. Never forget that.
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"Robert Miller" <rmiller0100@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<nLWdnUnxTdRxfDiiRVn-jA@comcast.com>...
I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
Yes, he will. Problem is, he won't accept your promissory note. Your
credit is no good in his court. He will accept the Federal Reserve's
note. Their credit is the only credit good enough for his court.
--
Chris Green
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Robert Miller wrote:
Which they had every authority to do within Federal Jurisdiction but
the federal government did not have the authority to make Federal Reserve
Notes legal tender in the States.
And all this time I thought you were serious about your diatribes
against the American legal system as opposed to that in England.
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Silver
Yeah, I guess that 100% mark-up over the price of the silver puts a damper
on universal acceptance. They are pretty, though.
So tell me, what's the mark up of unbacked promissory note, also know as
a Federal Reserve Note?
Robert Miller
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
Fun is good, Bob. Never forget that.
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
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You asked a question; I gave a correct answer.
The fact that you want a different answer, or to use your
question to further your political agenda does not interest me.
--
Brett
Yes you did. I respect you for that. Correct answers are more important
than
just furthering some political agenda. They are based in reason and a
fundamental
building block of any civilized society.
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
*****************************************************************
* Personal Injury/Malpractice Bankruptcy *
* *
* BRETT WEISS, P.C. *
* Attorneys at Law *
* Maryland, D.C. and Federal Bars *
* lawyer@erols.com *
* http://www.erols.com/lawyer *
* *
* Small Business Estates & Estate Planning *
*****************************************************************
The Small Print: This response is for discussion purposes only.
It isn't meant to be legal advice and you shouldn't treat it as
such. If you want legal advice, speak with a local lawyer
familiar with your state's laws who can review *all* of the facts
and the law applicable to your situation.
*****************************************************************
other person has
in cash, in
notes are
concepts
the
told
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"Robert Miller" <rmiller0100@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:<nLWdnUnxTdRxfDiiRVn-jA@comcast.com>...
I don't have enough money to pay my fine. I wonder if the Judge will
allow
me
to my fine with a promissory note in lieu of tender. I have heard that
Judges are
forbidden by law from demanding credit to pay a fine.
Yes, he will. Problem is, he won't accept your promissory note. Your
credit is no good in his court. He will accept the Federal Reserve's
note. Their credit is the only credit good enough for his court.
--
Chris Green
I don't say if it's my promissory note or any other kind of promissory
note. I merely ask if the Judge will accept a promissory notein lieu of
tender. I then leave to the Judge to say yes or no.
When he says "no", I ask him how he'd like me to pay my fine.
So we are reminded what tender is (most have forgotten)
TENDER, contracts, pleadings. A tender is an offer to do or perform an
act
which the party offering, is bound to perform to the party to whom the offer
is made.
2. A tender may be of money or of specific articles; these will be
separately
considered. Sec. 1. Of the lender of money. To make la valid tender the
following requisites are necessary: 1. It must be made by a person capable
of
paying: for if it be made by a stranger without the consent of the debtor,
it
will be insufficient. Cro. Eliz. 48, 132; 2 M. & S. 86; Co. Lit. 206.
3.-2. It must be made to the creditor having capacity to receive it, or
to his authorized agent. 1 Camp. 477; Dougl. 632; 5 Taunt. 307; S. C. 1
Marsh. 55; 6 Esp. 95; 3 T. R. 683; 14 Serg. & Rawle, 307; 1 Nev. & M. 398;
S. C. 28 E. C. L. R. 324; 4 B. & C. 29 S. C. 10 E. C. L. R. 272; 3 C. & P.
453 S. C. 14 E. C. L. R. 386; 1 M. & W. 310; M. & M. 238; 1 Esp. R. 349 1 C.
& P. 365
4.-3. The whole sum due must be offered, in the lawful coin of the
United
States, or foreign coin made current by law; 2 N. & M. 519; and the offer
must
be unqualified by any circumstance whatever. 2 T. R. 305; 1 Campb. 131; 3
Campb. 70; 6 Taunt. 336; 3 Esp. C. 91; Stark. Ev. pt. 4, page 1392, n. g; 4
Campb. 156; 2 Campb. 21; 1 M. & W. 310. But a tender in bank notes, if
not objected to on that account, will be good. 3 T. R. 554; 2 B. & P. 526; 1
Leigh's N. P. c. 1, S. 20; 9 Pick. 539; see 2 Caines, 116; 13 Mass. 235; 4
N. H.
Rep. 296; 10 Wheat 333. But in such case, the amount tendered must be what
is due exactly, for a tender of a five dollar note, demanding change, would
not
be a good tender of four dollars. 3 Campb. R. 70; 6 Taunt. R. 336; 2 Esp. R.
710; 2 D. & R. 305; S. C. 16 E. C. L. R. 87. And a tender was held good when
made by a check contained in a letter, requesting a receipt in return which
the
plaintiff sent back demanding a larger sum, without objecting to the nature
of
the tender. 8 D. P. C. 442. When stock is to be tendered, everything must be
done by the debtor to enable him to transfer it, but it is not absolutely
requisite
that it should be transferred. Str. 504, 533, 579.
5.-4. If a term had been stipulated in favor of a creditor, it must be
expired;
the offer should be made at the time agreed upon for the performance of the
contract if made afterwards, it only goes in mitigation of damages, provided
it
be made before suit brought. 7 Taunt. 487; 8 East, R. 168; 5 Taunt. 240; 1
Saund. 33 a, note 2. The tender ought to be made before daylight is entirely
gone. 7 Greenl. 31.
6.-5. The condition on which the debt was contracted must be fulfilled.
7.-6. The tender must be made at the place agreed upon for the payment,
or, if there be no place appointed for that purpose, then to the creditor or
his
authorized agent. 8 John. 474; Lit. Sel. Cas. 132; Bac. Ab. h.t. c.
8. When a tender has been properly made, it is a complete defence to
the
action but the benefit of a tender is lost, if the creditor afterwards
demand
the thing due from the debtor, and the latter refuse to pay it. Kirby, 293.
9.-Sec. 2. Of the tender of specific articles. It is a rule that
specific articles
maybe tendered at some particular place, and not, like money, to the person
of the creditor wherever found. When no place is expressly mentioned in the
contract, the place of delivery is to be ascertained by the intent of the
parties,
to be collected from the nature of the case and its circumstances. If, for
example,
the contract is for delivery of goods from the seller to the buyer on
demand, the
former being the manufacturer of the goods or a dealer in them, no place
being
particularly named, the manufactory or store of the seller will be
considered as
the place intended, and a tender there will be sufficient. When the specific
articles
are at another place at the time of sale, that will be the place of
delivery. 2 Greenl.
Ev. Sec. 609 4 Wend. 377; 2 Applet. 325.
10. When the goods are cumbrous, and the place of delivery is not
designated,
nor to be inferred from the circumstances, it is presumed that it was
intended that
they should be delivered at any place which the creditor might reasonably
appoint;
if the creditor refuses, or names an unreasonable place, the debtor may
select a
proper place, and having given notice to the creditor, deliver the goods
there. 2 Kent,
Comm. 507; 1 Greenl. 120; Chip. on Contr. 51 13 Wend. 95; 2 Greenl. Ev.
Sec. 610.
Vide, generally, 20 Vin., Ab. 177; Bac. Ab. h.t.; 1 Sell. 314; Com. Dig.
Action upon
the case upon Assumpsit, H 8 Condition, L 4 Pleader, 2 G 2-2 W, 28,49-3 K
23-3
M 36; Chipm, on Contr. 31, 74; Ayl. Pand. B. 4, t. 29; 7 Greenl. 31 Bouv.
Inst. Index, h.t.
Robert Miller
member of www.norfed.org
Bringing America back to value $1 at a time.
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You know, Bob, you constitutional law k00ks creep me the @$#* out. Do you
know the Kazoo? Does your place of employment pay you in that fake Liberty
money?
I have been paid with Silver Libertys. I can not take all my pay in Silver
Libertys.
Why not?
I would not mind receiving 25% of my pay that way. Some places
do
not mind saving saving as much as 10% on my payroll.
Red flag here! *WHY* do they save 10% on payroll? It suggests to
me that there are one or more problems with accepting Silver Libertys
in a country where prices are almost universally in Federal Reserve
Notes:
1) The commissions built into the exchange rates are awful. They
may not be that much worse than that for other currencies, but 10%
is still awful.
2) Buying Silver Libertys is very inconvenient, making it worth
taking a 10% pay cut to have someone else do it for you. Otherwise,
why not take your pay in FRN's and buy the Silver Libertys yourself?
3) Something having to do with the transfer of Silver Libertys
from one person to another being subject to sales tax, which would
really put a damper on using them.
4) Something having to do with not reporting the transaction for
income tax purposes, which the IRS won't agree with if it finds out.
I can see why Silver Libertys might be a good *INVESTMENT*, but
I'm not sure why I'd want to use them for transactions. Bad money
drives out good. If FRNs are so bad, why not get rid of them and
keep the GOOD currency?
Since I have very little trouble spending them for gas, groceries,
autoparts, >even traffic fines. I just can't expect to spend them
everywhere.
Lots of things can be used to get goods and services (legally or
otherwise) that aren't currency: beer, cigarettes (especially in
prisons), cocaine, sex, jewelry, diamonds, weapons, and then there's
currency of some other country.
Gordon L. Burditt
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You know, Bob, you constitutional law k00ks creep me the @$#* out. Do
you
know the Kazoo? Does your place of employment pay you in that fake
Liberty
money?
I have been paid with Silver Libertys. I can not take all my pay in
Silver
Libertys.
Why not?
Because most people have to deposit money I pay for things with into a bank.
I can spend over a hundred dollars with little trouble. | | |
