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Hello,
After christmas break, my roommate and I snagged a couch for our room
from the lounge down the hall. We planned on keeping it in our room
until the end of the year and returning it to the lounge. However,
after returning for spring break, we found that the couch was removed
from our room and returned to the lounge. The next day, I received an
email stating the following:
During the Spring break, safety inspections were made of all resident
rooms. At this time, University property of a Sofa from the Lounge
was discovered in your room. The furniture and/or furnishings are to
be in common areas for all residents of this building to utilize and
not for individual residents to confiscate for personal use.
Your student account is being charged for unauthorized removal of this
property and it's use on a per day basis since it has been missing
from the lounge. If the furniture is damaged you may be responsible
for the purchase of a replacement item.
This information is also being forwarded to [Residence Area
Coordinator]. It will be up to his discretion if he chooses to charge
you as well.
Since we had no intention on keeping the couch after the end of the
school year, I think that we have actually "converted" the couch
rather than "stole" it. Furthermore, a per-day based fine seems a
little absurd for something like this, especially since we have had
the couch for almost 3 months and it was returned completely
undamaged. And then on top of that, I may be responsible for
disciplinary action as well. Please share your opinions as to how I
can respond to this matter.
Thank you for your time. - Pete
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After christmas break, my roommate and I snagged a couch for our room
"snagged" sounds like a polite word for "stole".
from the lounge down the hall. We planned on keeping it in our room
until the end of the year and returning it to the lounge. However,
after returning for spring break, we found that the couch was removed
from our room and returned to the lounge. The next day, I received an
email stating the following:
During the Spring break, safety inspections were made of all resident
rooms. At this time, University property of a Sofa from the Lounge
was discovered in your room. The furniture and/or furnishings are to
be in common areas for all residents of this building to utilize and
not for individual residents to confiscate for personal use.
Your student account is being charged for unauthorized removal of this
property and it's use on a per day basis since it has been missing
from the lounge. If the furniture is damaged you may be responsible
for the purchase of a replacement item.
This information is also being forwarded to [Residence Area
Coordinator]. It will be up to his discretion if he chooses to charge
you as well.
Since we had no intention on keeping the couch after the end of the
school year, I think that we have actually "converted" the couch
rather than "stole" it.
Did the email use the word "stole"? Are you being charged with
theft? If not, what difference does it make? Both "conversion"
and "stealing" are crimes. More importantly, what you did probably
violates the agreement between you and the University about the
terms of your living in the residence hall. That agreement probably
says they can fine you.
Furthermore, a per-day based fine seems a
little absurd for something like this,
It seems less absurd than prison time, which you may deserve.
especially since we have had
the couch for almost 3 months and it was returned completely
undamaged.
So how does the fine compare with 3 months rent of a similar couch
from a furniture rental business? The fine may be excessive if it
exceeds the value of the couch.
And then on top of that, I may be responsible for
disciplinary action as well. Please share your opinions as to how I
can respond to this matter.
Pay your fine unless it's totally unreasonable (e.g. it exceeds
twice the value of a NEW couch of similar type). Grovel for
forgiveness.
Gordon L. Burditt
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Your casual words like "snagged" don't lighten the offense.
Respond by showing remorse and paying the fine so they don't hold back your
diploma about five years from now.
Hello,
After christmas break, my roommate and I snagged a couch for our room
from the lounge down the hall. We planned on keeping it in our room
until the end of the year and returning it to the lounge. However,
after returning for spring break, we found that the couch was removed
from our room and returned to the lounge. The next day, I received an
email stating the following:
During the Spring break, safety inspections were made of all resident
rooms. At this time, University property of a Sofa from the Lounge
was discovered in your room. The furniture and/or furnishings are to
be in common areas for all residents of this building to utilize and
not for individual residents to confiscate for personal use.
Your student account is being charged for unauthorized removal of this
property and it's use on a per day basis since it has been missing
from the lounge. If the furniture is damaged you may be responsible
for the purchase of a replacement item.
This information is also being forwarded to [Residence Area
Coordinator]. It will be up to his discretion if he chooses to charge
you as well.
Since we had no intention on keeping the couch after the end of the
school year, I think that we have actually "converted" the couch
rather than "stole" it. Furthermore, a per-day based fine seems a
little absurd for something like this, especially since we have had
the couch for almost 3 months and it was returned completely
undamaged. And then on top of that, I may be responsible for
disciplinary action as well. Please share your opinions as to how I
can respond to this matter.
Thank you for your time. - Pete
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On 23 Mar 2004 13:13:25 -0800, puskarpn@notes.udayton.edu (Pete)
wrote:
After christmas break, my roommate and I snagged a couch for our room
from the lounge down the hall. We planned on keeping it in our room
until the end of the year and returning it to the lounge. However,
after returning for spring break, we found that the couch was removed
from our room and returned to the lounge. The next day, I received an
email stating the following:
During the Spring break, safety inspections were made of all resident
rooms. At this time, University property of a Sofa from the Lounge
was discovered in your room. The furniture and/or furnishings are to
be in common areas for all residents of this building to utilize and
not for individual residents to confiscate for personal use.
Your student account is being charged for unauthorized removal of this
property and it's use on a per day basis since it has been missing
from the lounge. If the furniture is damaged you may be responsible
for the purchase of a replacement item.
This information is also being forwarded to [Residence Area
Coordinator]. It will be up to his discretion if he chooses to charge
you as well.
Since we had no intention on keeping the couch after the end of the
school year, I think that we have actually "converted" the couch
rather than "stole" it.
The common law definition of theft is to take something away from
someone with the intention of never returning it. Under that
definition, you didn't steal it. Some jurisdictions, including Ohio,
have softened the permanency requirement.
What difference does it make, though? You took the university's
property without permission.
The more interesting question is what rights they have over your
student account, whether just because they've decided you did
something you shouldn't, they can charge the account. For that, you'd
probably have to look at the terms of the account.
Furthermore, a per-day based fine seems a
little absurd for something like this, especially since we have had
the couch for almost 3 months and it was returned completely
undamaged. And then on top of that, I may be responsible for
disciplinary action as well. Please share your opinions as to how I
can respond to this matter.
You made the couch; now lie in it.
------------------------------
Bob Stock, California Attorney
Nothing I've said should be relied on as legal advice.
------------------------------
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puskarpn@notes.udayton.edu (Pete) wrote in message news:<2e3f8b53.0403231313.7354b8a5@posting.google.com>...
Hello,
After christmas break, my roommate and I snagged a couch for our room
from the lounge down the hall. We planned on keeping it in our room
until the end of the year and returning it to the lounge. However,
after returning for spring break, we found that the couch was removed
from our room and returned to the lounge. The next day, I received an
email stating the following:
During the Spring break, safety inspections were made of all resident
rooms. At this time, University property of a Sofa from the Lounge
was discovered in your room. The furniture and/or furnishings are to
be in common areas for all residents of this building to utilize and
not for individual residents to confiscate for personal use.
Your student account is being charged for unauthorized removal of this
property and it's use on a per day basis since it has been missing
from the lounge. If the furniture is damaged you may be responsible
for the purchase of a replacement item.
This information is also being forwarded to [Residence Area
Coordinator]. It will be up to his discretion if he chooses to charge
you as well.
Since we had no intention on keeping the couch after the end of the
school year, I think that we have actually "converted" the couch
rather than "stole" it. Furthermore, a per-day based fine seems a
little absurd for something like this, especially since we have had
the couch for almost 3 months and it was returned completely
undamaged. And then on top of that, I may be responsible for
disciplinary action as well. Please share your opinions as to how I
can respond to this matter.
Well, since they didn't turn you over to the campus police for theft
(yet), you're not doing too badly. If they start talking about theft
or other serious charges, get a lawyer right away. Your argument that
your intent to return the couch makes it something less than theft is
not a strong one, and if you need it to prevail, you need all the help
you can get.
Most colleges are aware that they are dealing with students who are
just beginning to grasp the rudiments of adult social norms, so they
tend to lighten up on wrongdoers who come across as contrite and
willing to accept responsibility and consequences for their actions.
So long as the matter remains within the college discipline system,
and you don't already have a record of run-ins, you're unlikely to
come out with unacceptable consequences.
--
Not a lawyer,
Chris Green
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After christmas break, my roommate and I snagged a couch for our room
from the lounge down the hall...
Pay the fine and be thankful they didn't expel you and / or press criminal
charges.
--
John Goulden
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